[gearhead]

Anyone had a chance to take the cover off and have a look?
Not that it matters either way to me, I trust todays electronics and the myriad of redundant safety checks that are put into place (disregarding Toyota's recent fiasco of course).
Just curious.

 

[Dave25]

they are drive by wire like all other vehicles.

GM is not Toyota, they would recall BEFORE people die, not hide the problem and deny it until they get sued by dead customers' families like Toyota.

 

[gearhead]

they are drive by wire like all other vehicles.

GM is not Toyota, they would recall BEFORE people die, not hide the problem and deny it until they get sued by dead customers' families like Toyota.

Thanks Dave25.
I was searching after I started this topic and ran across some good info for anyone else who may be interested:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drive_by_wire

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_throttle_control

Here's a good pic of a motor actuator (I think 36 is the motor which connects to the gears (48, 50 (probably a belt?), 52), bushings (40, 12) and shafts (38 and ? (#off page) to control the throttle valve) for a throttle body:

One statement I find particularly interesting:

ETC provides only a very limited benefit in areas such as air-fuel ratio control, exhaust emissions and fuel consumption reduction, working in concert with other technologies such as gasoline direct injection.

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_throttle_control, third paragraph down).

Doesn't make much sense that where the air comes in has little bearing on air-fuel ratio control.
I guess the air flow must also be controlled closer to the combustion chambers, especially in a direct injection setup such as the 3.0L in our Terrain.

 

[gearhead]

they are drive by wire like all other vehicles.

GM is not Toyota, they would recall BEFORE people die, not hide the problem and deny it until they get sued by dead customers' families like Toyota.[/color]

I wonder why Toyota had so many problems with what should have been a simple fix.
First off, the floor mats, no big deal.
The part that baffles me is the problem with the electronics software and hardware.
Surely a software program can anticipate and stop a runaway condition as can a hardware sensor.
I realize that can be harder to debug.
Did Toyota ever fess up to what the underlying problem/s was/were and I'm not talking floor mats?

 

[Dave25]

Last I heard Toyota claimed that a spacer was needed for the throttle pedal. They also "proved" that many of the cases against them were money grabs. The floor mat claim is so ridiculous it should be insulting to all of their customers. If Gm had pulled that they would currently be out of business.

 

[gearhead]

Last I heard Toyota claimed that a spacer was needed for the throttle pedal. They also "proved" that many of the cases against them were money grabs. The floor mat claim is so ridiculous it should be insulting to all of their customers. If Gm had pulled that they would currently be out of business.

Thanks Dave25.
I wonder what a spacer has to do with not being able to kill the engine during a runaway condition?
Time for a lot more reading I guess!
LOL!

 

[gar187er]

Thanks Dave25.
I wonder what a spacer has to do with not being able to kill the engine during a runaway condition?
Time for a lot more reading I guess!
LOL!

nothing other then the fact is was freaking customers out not to to realize just turn the **** car off, or throw it in neutral and blow the engine...

 

[Denali AWD]

nothing other then the fact is was freaking customers out not to to realize just turn the **** car off, or throw it in neutral and blow the engine...

It wouldn't even blow the engine. All modern computer controlled engines have either a rev limiter (set to activate at the redline of the engine) or a preset maximum RPM that is allowed when the transmission is in neutral or park.

As pointed out, in a panic situation a lot of people don't think about many alternatives except pressing harder on the brake pedal.

 

[adamjeeps]

they are drive by wire like all other vehicles.

GM is not Toyota, they would recall BEFORE people die, not hide the problem and deny it until they get sued by dead customers' families like Toyota.

I was searching about drive by wire and stumbled upon this post. Sadly proven to be false.


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[JayTee2014]

I was searching about drive by wire and stumbled upon this post. Sadly proven to be false.


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Sadly? Not sure what you mean. But an analogy of how the accelerator works on modern car engine would be similar to a volume control on a stereo. When you depress the pedal, rather than a cable directly opening the throttle for the engine, a sensor or variable resistor is attached to the pedal and feeds a signal to the ECM (engine control module). The ECM is calibrated to the sensor from the pedal and responds by delivering the proper amount of air and fuel based on what the engine requires at the time. There are safety features built in to ECM fuel delivery system so that any erroneous sensor or operating conditions are monitored and will result in shut off or reduced power from the engine.

Air craft and other equipment have been using systems like this for years.

 

[adamjeeps]

I was referring to the recall, or lack thereof on GM's part, not the drive by wire function.


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[JayTee2014]

I was referring to the recall, or lack thereof on GM's part, not the drive by wire function.


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I'm sorry. Still lost on what you are referring to. This is a 4 year old thread. Recall? Sadly not the case? It is like a large part of what you are trying to say is missing.

Perhaps if you include a quote to who or what you are responding to the context will then make sense. J

 

[adamjeeps]

GM is not Toyota, they would recall BEFORE people die, not hide the problem and deny it until they get sued by dead customers' families like Toyota.

GM Ignition Switch Recall.

 

[JayTee2014]

The ignition switch? That is old news. Honda (+ 1,700 deaths & injuries) tops GM's simple negligence and only a few proven deaths with the below.
But the real question is why was the news of the GM switch issue on national news for month's on end and we hear nothing about Honda when the deaths and injuries far surpass GM? Plus, GM's switch due to a design flaw from a supplier and simple negligence and GM's archaic management system at the time. Honda, on the other hand, deliberately concealed safety issues resulting in deaths and injuries for 11 years! And no prolonged sensationalist month after month news reports.


http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/01/08/375914334/honda-fined-70-million-for-underreporting-deaths-and-injuries

*
"The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has fined Honda $70 million, for according to NHTSA, "failing to report deaths, injuries, and certain warranty claims to the federal government." NHTSA says Honda failed to report 1,729 death and injury claims tied to their vehicles between 2003 and 2014, and that the company failed to submit "early warning reports identifying potential or actual safety issues." The NHTSA also claims Honda underreported warranty and customer dissatisfaction claims."

*
" The fines might not be the only penalty that Honda faces due to the lack of reporting.

Transportation Department officials Thursday said they have talked to the Justice Department about the results of their probe.

The Center for Auto Safety, a public interest group, has called for the U.S. to bring criminal charges against Honda.

It's now up to Justice as to whether to pursue a criminal case.

Honda says is it cooperating with NHTSA to fix problems in its reporting of accident data. "


http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/01/08/375914334/honda-fined-70-million-for-underreporting-deaths-and-injuries

 

[JayTee2014]

Well Mr. Jeeps? :shrug:

 

[adamjeeps]

Well the fact is they all are in business to make money and every decision they make is based on that principle first.




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[JayTee2014]

So then, what was the point of resurrecting a 3 year old thread that was about drive by wire with a comment about the unrelated ignition switch recall?

I'm just puzzled and curious about the intent and connection.

Yes, the car business is about making money as all business is. But do you see my point about Honda having grossly exceeded the deaths and injuries over GM and hardly a mention of it in the news? And, they already got fined twice what GM got fined and still face more civil and private penalties. All absent from the nightly and morning national news . . .. unlike putting GM up on the rack due to admittedly, bad previous management.

What IS sad is how the media and the public like to have a whipping boy to beat on when a business like GM was down and trying to honestly recover.

 

[adamjeeps]

Thought it was funny how some GM fanboys will claim GM is never going to do anything illegal or even unethical. That's all. They are all the same. Deny anything is wrong until it becomes obvious there is a huge problem.

The reason I was searching drive by wire is a member on another forum had a question regarding a service recommendation to "service the Throttle Linkage". Is there any such thing with drive by wire?

 

[JayTee2014]

Linkage? Not sure, except on some earlier types of electronic fuel injection/throttle control.

I do know in the early 80's to early 90's when cars first had throttle body injection and then early multi port (not sequential) injection, there was a cable that connected to a TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) at the base of the throttle body itself. The cable actually opened and closed the physical throttle plate, but the ECM controlled the fuel injected into the throttle or fuel injectors themselves. What is interesting, is about the same time, stepper motor operated cruise controls were implemented on car engines. The motor ran in tandem with the gas pedal. It was just a matter of time before they started using a stepper motor to control the throttle plate all the time and placed the TPS close to, attached, or linked to the accelerator pedal.

So that is what we have today. A pedal with TPS, fed to the ECM, which operates and controls both the air (throttle) and fuel (injectors) on the engine. This way, the computer in the ECM can monitor and control through various other sensors, what the engine needs depending on load, ambient temperature, is the engine in "warm up" mode, altitude, and many other parameters.

 

[adamjeeps]

Linkage? Not sure, except on some earlier types of electronic fuel injection/throttle control.

I do know in the early 80's to early 90's when cars first had throttle body injection and then early multi port (not sequential) injection, there was a cable that connected to a TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) at the base of the throttle body itself. The cable actually opened and closed the physical throttle plate, but the ECM controlled the fuel injected into the throttle or fuel injectors themselves. What is interesting, is about the same time, stepper motor operated cruise controls were implemented on car engines. The motor ran in tandem with the gas pedal. It was just a matter of time before they started using a stepper motor to control the throttle plate all the time and placed the TPS close to, attached, or linked to the accelerator pedal.

So that is what we have today. A pedal with TPS, fed to the ECM, which operates and controls both the air (throttle) and fuel (injectors) on the engine. This way, the computer in the ECM can monitor and control through various other sensors, what the engine needs depending on load, ambient temperature, is the engine in "warm up" mode, altitude, and many other parameters.

Thank you for that info. Is it safe to say the guy got ripped off for having "service the Throttle Linkage" performed on his 2010 SRX? I don't know what they could have done? Grease the gas pedal lol??