[Trixie11]

So after trying to figure out the "Service Power Steering" DIC, BRAKE, ABS, Trac lights problem I've had for the last 9 months - yesterday - after several more hours or searching, I came across this:

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2014/SB-10081067-0335.pdf

I have a 2013 and it has no problem with the steering, just the lights, warnings and messages. I see on the description that for 2013 they only reprogram the module and don't add or replace any parts. The truly outstanding this is - this Terrain was purchased in the last week of February 2013 so the special coverage warranty expired 2 weeks ago. I didn't know anything about it until yesterday, although I have had the problem for 9 months.

My question is especially for anyone who has had a problem like I've described (see my other threads) - did this fix have anything to do with your problem and did it fix it? You can imagine how sick I am to find out about this days after the 10 years ran out.

 

[Colt Hero]

@Trixie11 : I'd call the Dealership Parts Department (with your VIN# in hand) and ask them to look in the GM Global Warranty Management System to see if your VIN should've had this SCA (SB 14232) applied. I would think they'd be able to look that up ... but they might forward you to the dreaded Service Department. If they say you have to bring the vehicle in, try another Dealership (any GM Dealership ... even out-of-town) until someone gives you the answer over the phone.

Your vehicle may not have been included. Note ... the SCA says "some ... may have increased friction".

As for why you might be getting "Service Power Steering" messages, but yet no SCA applies ... have you checked the PS Fluid Reservoir? Or, have you scanned your OBD-2 Port for Codes? Maybe something else is going on and you're actually barking up the wrong tree ...

 

[rbarrios]

Dont feel bad, ive been on this forum for 10 yrs, had never seen that bulletin.

 

[Trixie11]

I found out about it by logging in to the GMC website and checking on the "warranty" section of my account page. This isn't my car. It was my father's car and he just passed away. I had assumed that once the 3 year 36k miles were up, that I didn't have to worry about any expiring dates - so after seeing this special overage (which I had never heard of or about before), I then dug up his paperwork on the car and sure enough, there among the recall letters/postcards was this special warranty for his vehicle. The thing that is unclear and what caught my attention is that I do have many of the symptoms listed, just not the problem with steering. Since these problems all started, there has been no change I can tell other than the lights and the collision alert and lane depart not working. So I can't tell if this reprogramming of the module would fix this problem or if it has absolutely nothing to do with it. The other two recalls - for headlights and O2 sensor were also not acted upon for the same reason - there didn't seem to be any problem and why fix what isn't broken?

 

[Colt Hero]

I just noticed that this SCA makes no reference to Engine size ... it only mentions years, makes, and models. My 2011 (3.0L) has Hydraulic Steering ... but the 2011 with the 2.4L has Electric Steering. Can you tell from the Parts List if this SCA is only for the Electric Steering models? It seems like it is ... but you'd think they would've been clearer about it. Normally, Engine Size is mentioned in these Bulletins.

@Trixie11 : I don't have "Collision Alert" or "Lane Departure" ... but those things work via Sensor and Cameras. I would think if you're seeing DIC failure Lights for these things that you have a Sensor or Camera issue going on.

Here is more information from a previous Thread on this Forum:

Collision Alert - GMC Terrain 2015

I've been using the collision alert on my terrain and only a few times it's acted up. For no reason, it goes off like a crash is imminent and I feel it slows down some. There is nothing in the way and has happened with a freshly clean and dirty vehicle. My thought was a dirty sensor. I've...

www.terrainforum.net

 

[Trixie11]

Yeah, I had read all those related threads. The car has 17k miles on it and is in brand-new condition and has lived 24/7 inside a garage. The camera is crystal clear. I had seen previous discussions say that when one of the wheel speed sensors or ABS sensors go bad, that these two things stop working because the computer required information on wheel speed/steering angle to know how to compute the alarms - but who knows. This vehicle has electric power steering (EPS). That is one of the reasons I've been dealing with the nightmare of trying to figure out the J-case fuses. And one of the first things I checked months ago was when I went to check the PS fluid and couldn't find any (because there isn't any).

 

[Colt Hero]

@Trixie11: But Wheel Speed Sensors throw OBD-2 Codes (like C0035, for example). And with so little mileage and use, I wouldn't expect any Magnetic Rings on the backsides of the Hubs to have cracked off (but you can check for that, too).

I've still got the above (C0035) Code on my 2011 (because the M/R is cracked on the Hub) and it sometimes causes the ABS to chatter the brakes at very low speed (coming out of my driveway, or leaving a parking lot). This has been going on for over a year, and I have the replacement Hub ... just haven't installed it. If your ABS isn't chattering the brakes, and no OBD-2 Codes, then I'd say you probably don't have a Wheel Speed Sensor issue.

Which Camera does the vehicle use for the Lane Departure? Is it on the backside of the mirror (facing forward), or is it in the Front Bumper?

 

[Trixie11]

The camera is just above the rear-view mirror facing front. If you want to see the whole history of my issues, you should read all my posts/threads started. Everything was perfect until a trip to the store last summer. Went out the next day and the battery was dead. Thought it was just an old battery so went and got a new one. 1 day later, that fully-charged and tested battery died. Thought it was THAT battery so back for a third battery. Same thing. Batteries all die within 24 hours if car is not started and run for 20 minutes every day. So every day I have to go for a 20 minute drive or I know that I am going to have to deal with taking the computer off the top, taking the cables off and hooking it up to the charger. Anyway - within a couple of weeks of this whole battery thing starting, everything still fine - go to start and the BRAKE, ABS and curvy lines under car logo (traction) lights are all on and "Service Power Steering" alarm and message on DIC. I have been driving around like this with all this going on ever since then. I went to make an appointment at my local GMC dealer and even though I wrote them a detailed description and was going to get there first thing in the morning, they said that for any repairs that I had to leave the car there and pick a form of transportation back. That pissed me off because I have never had to leave any car at any dealer for even major repairs like a clutch replacement. I have always waited there for it to get done. So in the mean time I took the car to Autozone and Advance to get any codes read. But there are no codes and no CEL on. And apparently I have to go out and spend a lot of money to buy a code scanner capable of reading ABS codes. So I have gone back and forth between trying to decide whether or not to buy a scanner and new digital multimeter to track down the parasitic drain or use this coupon the dealer sent for free diagnostic "$160 value" and have them tell me what is wrong. But like I had mentioned - my father could afford stuff like this. I can't. Not to mention I have multiple other daily disasters happening besides this one and the dealer is like 20 miles away. I have to think it is something really simple like a broken or frayed wire or blown fuse because the car is basically brand new. That's why I sort of felt sick when I came across this special coverage thing within days of it ending. That would be just my luck. Although I don't know how much just a re-programming of the computer would be. Maybe that is all that it is. I was pretty careful when I was replacing those batteries, but I suppose something happened that the computers didn't like. I don't know if the battery drain and power steering problems are related or not.

 

[garagerog]

Trixie, just a note, you don't have to go thru that rigmarole of removing the ecm to get to your battery posts to charge your battery. You should have remote battery charging/testing posts near the fuse box, the positive one should be covered with a red plastic cap, the negative one is nearby, an aluminum stud marked with a - symbol.

 

[Trixie11]

Wow I wish I had known that. I've had to take that **** thing off about 20 times over the last 9 months. I just dealt with the big RED post yesterday because I was examining the terrible J-case fuses to figure out if any of the ABS/EPS ones were blown. But those J-case fuses are a mystery and a pain in the butt. One of the tops popped off and fell down behind the coolant tank and it took an hour for me to find it. I'll have to search for the negative post. I'll be the first person to admit that I am way out of my depth even trying to deal with this situation. But that is also the case for every other problem I have inherited as a result of my father's death. I hate getting ripped-off. And I feel like the moment I roll into a dealer, they'll find all sorts of crap that needs to be done.

 

[Colt Hero]

@Trixie11 : I just read all your Posts. My gut feeling is you have a parasitic drain somewhere.

You know ... when I bought my 2011 brand new (just two years before your 2013 was built), I noticed the very tiny (aqua-colored) "courtesy" lamps in the center console stayed ON all the time. I thought that was odd ... never seen lights stay ON like that before ... but they were very tiny, and I thought they wouldn't cause any problem.

I was wrong. Dead battery occurred very quickly. Key stuck in the Ignition! I was able to charge the Battery, get the key out, and I thought that was the end of it. Nope! Dead Battery again! Seemed to me the problem was fixed sooner, but I just looked in my Maintenance Book and, apparently ... we tolerated this from January to May, when finally ... the Dealer reprogrammed the BCM to turn OFF those little "courtesy" lamps ... and that was the end of the problem!

I thought it was pretty sad that GM (or their Contractor) could not test software sufficiently to make sure such an obvious gaffe did not slip through the cracks! It should've been obvious to anybody doing even the most superficial testing that the software needed patching to turn the lights OFF!

So - it wouldn't surprise me if it turned out that your BCM needs re-programming, too. More bad, untested software being rolled out. We call that "user-test" software. You don't do any testing ... instead ... you just roll it out and wait for the User to find the bugs for you!

I think something is staying ON and draining your Battery. And this is causing most of your messages and idiot lights .. maybe all of them (since the vehicle is so new). The Brake Light, for example, is illuminated when the Electronic Brake Control Module (EBCM) detects the Fluid is low. It does this by a low voltage reading ... so a weak Battery can probably "fool" it into thinking the Fluid is low ... when it isn't. This is why you probably get all the unrelated messages popping up at once.

But where is the parasitic drain? That is the question.

If you go out at night (dark and quiet) and sit in the vehicle ... can you see any lights on anywhere, or hear anything humming?

Read this:

How to Find a Parasitic Battery Drain: 11 Steps (with Pictures)

If your vehicle is drawing power from the battery and all of the lights and other electrical components are off, you might have a parasitic battery drain (or draw). Luckily, you can usually find the cause of a parasitic draw yourself....

www.wikihow.com

.

====
Or ... how about this (OnStar Causing a Battery Drain)?

https://testing-public.carmd.com/Tsb/Download/107960/4036193#:~:text=This%20can%20cause%20a%20dead,%C2%AE%20system%20is%20not%20active.&text=Dealers%20are%20to%20replace%20the%20OnStar%C2%AE%20module

.

 

[Trixie11]

As you might imagine, having spent 9 months researching various aspects, causes and solutions for these problems there is almost nothing I haven't read or watched online. I know for sure there is a drain but until I buy a new digital multimeter, I can't start pulling fuses (which is one reason the J-case fuses are a potential problem for me). One thing I do know for sure is that there are no lights on anywhere, inside/outside big small, glovebox, center console, etc....- that is one of the reasons I asked the other day about this light dimmer switch and that extra notch on the right. Thought maybe it had turned something "on" but apparently not. I don't know how much the dealer charges for "reprogramming" one or more of the BCM.ECM computers. Which is why I am concerned about this special coverage warranty - which includes such a reprogramming for 2013 Terrains, and which I have just missed-out on by 2 weeks.

 

[Trixie11]

So after 3 more days of poking around and internet research, plus reading about 100 posts on this site, I am wondering if my problems could be from this 80-amp mega/midi fuse just outside the engine compartment fuse box. Its #55 and it is for the EPS. While I have not ever jumped anyone (or been jumped), this all did happen right around the whole dead/new/replacing battery situation so I am now wondering if this fuse is blown and if so - what symptoms that would produce. All I can find around here is an ancient analog multimeter.

 

[Trixie11]

No luck. Went out and tested the 80 amp and get matching approx. 12 volts on each side. Had hoped I finally figured it out. Also checked the connections on those two nuts and they are both tight. Then checked the ground under the opposite side near the corner of the passenger side firewall. That - just like everything else - is brand-new condition and clean and tight. So frustrating.

 

[repairman54]

If the EPS fuse was blown, you would have no power steering.
A full spectrum scan of all 4 code families is in order to even begin to track down any issues.
P codes are powertrain related and will trigger the check engine light but the B or body codes or U codes for example could indicate a module issue for example and will not trigger a check engine light.
Full scan is step one in any shop before they even open the hood.
Part store free scans are not full scans.

 

[Trixie11]

In every forum, in every thread, in every online discussion - the single most important piece of information that you can provide (but that never is provided) - is what/where/how is the absolute cheapest - and by cheapest I mean free or as close to free as possible - way to acquire the codes. I've posted on Cartalk, city data, reddit, and about 10 other online car repair forums and for some reason, everyone always says one of two things: what codes are being thrown / did you scan for the codes......yet never offers the most important suggestion - which is how to get the needed codes without either spending a fortune on a pricey scan tool or taking the vehicle to s shop. In my opinion, on a forum such as this that is brand and model specific - there should be a big fat sticky with this information. There are free scanning apps and practically free OBD/usb adapters and then there are scanners that cost hundreds - and everywhere in between. So it sure would be nice if every time someone inquired or commented about the codes - if they'd include the cheapest easiest way to find out what they are.

 

[Colt Hero]

@Trixie11 : I dunno ... at first, all I'd ever used was a simple Actron hand-held ... but when that became obsolete (because they had to change the protocol, of course ... to keep the money moving) ... I just bought an $80 Harbor Freight handheld (that can also read ABS). Also, when I thought I was about to purchase a brand new Chevy Bolt EV, I picked up a cheap Motorola Android phone in order to run the Torque Pro app (which was highly recommended by the Bolt crowd for dumping/verifying the Traction Battery's multiple voltage levels).

Without getting into really high-dollar, "professional-grade" scanners (like the Snap-On units you see in some online videos), there's Auto-Enginuity, which I believe @repairman54 uses (and will vouch for). I think I remember seeing cost numbers in the $300+ range for that one?

But my take on it is: If the CEL isn't ON ... and the vehicle is still running ... then I'm not caring about it ... because I'm not going to the Dealer to get all caught up in that circus! So ... I'll just wait until the CEL does come on, use my $80 scanner, and go from there.

If I were you ... I'd just be turning stuff OFF for now ... and waiting for more information.

But if you're not comfortable doing that ... the Dealer is waiting for you ... $150 "diagnostic" fee ... then whatever else they feel like whacking you for ...

 

[RIT333]

You can go to just about any auto parts store, and scan for cel codes, for free. But, as was mentioned, you are only getting the use of a cheap scanner. So, it seems like some auto parts stores ought to carry a higher lever scanner, and charge customers something like $20 to use that scanner. Seems like people would gladly pay that fee if they can avoid the hassle of going to a dealer, and paying the outrageously high fee that the dealer charges. Humm...

 

[superdave]

I don't mind paying $20 for a comprehensive scan, at least it is cheaper than $165 charges by the dealer for just looking at it. That way, I can prepare myself for the troubles I will be getting. We have no free code scanning by parts stores in Canada. I went to a quick lube shop and they offer a scan for $80... hack, I turned around and bought myself a basic scanner for $80. I have used it many times and it is paid for. I love to have a high end scanner but with my skill set I can't utilize nor understand the information it provides, this is why I didn't upgrade the scanner.

I remote started my car this morning and I saw the exhaust came out. When I got out and found the engine wasn't running. Tried the remote start next to it and no go. Went into the car and it started right up. No MIL, no abnormality. Drove out about 3KM and the MIL flashing at me. I have an appointment and can't stop to check but the car was running fine. Once arrived and I scanned it... P0300 - multiple misfires. Tried to reset and it won't budge because it is a permanent code. I started the car again when done with my appointment the MIL is gone. Cold weather hickup or trying to remind me who is the boss.

 

[Trixie11]

I just went back and examined the dates that I changed the battery and the whole ABS / power steering etc...issues started within days of that battery change sequence. Started with a 5-year old AC Delco that died with no warning, went to Walmart to get an H5 that one died so I assumed it was just a bad battery and exchanged it for another identical one - which has been in there ever since. I've seen the whole issue with the blown 80 amp EPS fuse when you jump start, so I figured that must have happened when I connected the battery but both sides getting 12v so that isn't it I guess. Then I read something about how if you don't keep power supplied to the car while you are switching batteries, the ECU/BCU power steering, etc,....will need to be recalibrated. I can't tell whether this can only be done by a scan tool, by the dealer or whether you need to perform some type of driving routine like turning the wheel lock-to-lock or something. Does anyone know about this?