GMC Terrain, Equinox, and SRX Forum banner

Disable the Auto Stop feature

330K views 262 replies 75 participants last post by  RIT333 
#1 ·
The auto stop feature in my 2018 Equinox is driving me crazy. I live in traffic plagued southern California, where creeping along is a way of life. The Auto Stop feature keeps killing the car while in traffic or in parking lots.

The Auto stop turns the engine off when the car comes to a stop instantly. In the case where the stop is momentary, you have to wait for the engine to re-start before being able to proceed.

In traffic, when creeping along, or start-stop, the engine stop has almost caused me to be rear-ended several times.

It also takes too long to start, causing a lag when trying to pull out into traffic. A very dangerous problem when trying to pull into traffic.

The concept is generally useful if there was a long traffic light, however the implementation is poorly done. There needs to be a programmable delay before the car simply turns off, or better yet a switch to disable it when in traffic.

Is there any way to turn this feature off? Or somehow control it?
 
#2 · (Edited by Moderator)
#9 ·
I have tried this - it works, however....

rednox has it right. I can attest that it works. I routinely shift to L and adjust the range to "9" and no more Start/Stop. My concern is the added wear/tear on the starter and battery, not to mention the lack of cooling transition for the turbo bearing and the oil for them.
I have tried this - it works, however, I am concerned that operating the vehicle in this manner could possibly damage the transmission (or cause added wear, or invalidate the warranty somehow....). It is also quite a nuisance to shift through all 9 gears in the beginning. The design should be seamless.
 
#4 ·
JGreg7, your not alone... I had rented a new Chevy Cruze but it also has the stupid auto-stop, so I took it off my shopping list. So when I looked at the new 2018 Equinox I turned it down in favor of a new 2017 Equinox with the main reason being the stupid auto-stop. The dealer wasn't surprised when I told him how much I disliked the auto-stop. ( seemed like he heard this complaint before ) Asked him why Chevy doesn't have a switch to turn it off, he just shrugged... Many other manufactures that I looked at do have an auto-stop switch. ( or don't have an auto-stop system at all ) Although the " M " workaround may work for some, it is not there as a switch for auto-stop its a manual gear range selector. ( and I'm sure someone will try this workaround and forget to choose the correct gear.... ) Enough said..
 
#5 · (Edited by Moderator)
It also takes too long to start, causing a lag when trying to pull out into traffic. A very dangerous problem when trying to pull into traffic.
This doesn't sound right to me. In the time it takes me to remove my foot from the brake and press the gas, the car is ready to accelerate.

On my car the engine only stops when the car stops. I don't understand how the engine stopping will cause a rear end collision. Auto Stop should not cause your car to come to a unexpected abrupt stop surprising the car behind you.
 
#8 ·
Traffic is the reason...

This doesn't sound right to me.
In the time it takes me to remove my foot from the brake and press the gas, the car is ready to accelerate.

On my car the engine only stops when the car stops. I don't understand how the engine stopping will cause a rear end collision.
Auto Stop should not cause your car to come to a unexpected abrupt stop surprising the car behind you.
I live in Southern California. Traffic is a challenge here, it is very heavy, with very long gaps or breaks where you ca pull into it. so you sit, and wait, and wait.... When trying to pull out into traffic, there is only a very small gap that you have to accelerate into. Try to start and jump into one of these gaps is delayed significantly by the engine needing to start. (I also have concerns that with the engine resting between these "waits", the oil may settle to the pan and not be available when the hard acceleration is needed).

The other issue, when creeping forward in traffic, as the brake lights go out, everyone is signaled to move. People start moving forward. However, when you don't actually go anywhere, the people behind you keep creeping up. While this is not a high-speed collision as in the example above, it is very troublesome.

My feeling is that the GM engineers that came up with this idea, did not fully understand the dynamics of high-traffic areas. A switch to disable this would be helpful. The idea would probably work well if there was a 5~10 second delay before killing the engine - at least in traffic.
 
#7 ·
There is a company that makes a module to disable the stop start function. At this time however it's mostly for Chrysler-Jeep vehicles. I contacted them and the owner said he was working on something for GM products and it would probably be available this spring. The website is smartstopstart.com I've been practicing a tecnique of my own for stopping and my motor rarely cuts off. It works by letting off slightly on the pedal before you come to a complete stop and then lightly reapplying the pedal. It's easy to do but hard to explain, just takes a little practice.
 
#18 · (Edited by Moderator)
There are EPA emission regs... but start stop does not help there as the measurement are done when engine is running.

I am not aware of any EPA mileage limitation on a given class of vehicles. May be i am wrong as far as i know EPA has regulations on the average mpg of all the vehicles on offer by manufacturers. It is 25 mpg right now but supposed to go to 35mpg in 2025 or 2030 . That is why for example GM has the electric Spark which is sold in California and sell in the 10s per year...so that they can sell the Traverse.
And in low gas price times...most pay no attention to the EPA mileage tag (except for people like me).

I suspect now that China is the largest automotive market... it may drive the design of vehicles sold there... just like California drive the emission of cars in the US. So may be if China has a reg on consumption on small SUV market and the nox is being sold there... then may be the design is a political decision

Since Toyota introduced this on its hybrids more than 10 years ago. I think it is more everybody is doing we can do it too... (may be engineering hubris; our starter can outlive a million starts). I drove a Mercedes B-series 5 years ago and it had it and it was way more aggressive than what is available on the nox.

I suspect start stop help on emission in congested cities more than it helps gain in gas mileage... but that is my guess, I have not read anything about it.
 
#22 · (Edited by Moderator)
There are EPA emission regs...but start stop does not help there as the measurement are done when engine is running.

I am not aware of any EPA mileage limitation on a given class of vehicles. May be i am wrong as far as i know EPA has regulations on the average mpg of all the vehicles on offer by manufacturers. It is 25 mpg right now but supposed to go to 35mpg in 2025 or 2030 . That is why for example GM has the electric Spark which is sold in California and sell in the 10s per year...so that they can sell the Traverse.
And in low gas price times...most pay no attention to the EPA mileage tag (except for people like me).

I suspect now that China is the largest automotive market ..it may drive the design of vehicles sold there...just like California drive the emission of cars in the US. So may be if China has a reg on consumption on small SUV market and the nox is being sold there...then may be the design is a political decision

Since Toyota introduced this on its hybrids more than 10 years ago..
I think it is more everybody is doing we can do it too.....(may be engineering hubris; our starter can outlive a million starts). I drove a Mercedes B-series 5 years ago and it had it and it was way more aggressive than what is available on the nox.
I suspect start stop help on emission in congested cities more than it helps gain in gas mileage...but that is my guess, i have not read anything about it.

EPA might be while it is running, but they may incorporate stops into the testing procedure.

That is imo why you have a lower city rating from the EPA, to account for traffic and stopping and going.

So to calculate that city measurement, if the vehicle is "stopped" (i doubt it is actually moving to begin with, likely on a dyno) and the engine shuts down, it might contribute enough of a benefit to make it qualify for a mpg or two in the other direction even if it has very little pay off in real life.

Same thing, no reading, just my 2 cents.
 
#26 ·
You all are driving 1.5's and 2.0's. You really want to be annoyed??? Try driving the diesel with start/stop. The engine takes just a few moment LONGER to re-fire. And that few moments makes driving in traffic immensely more dangerous. It is so bad that I predict a lawsuit or a reprogramming to defeat the S/S on the diesel.

I have been using the L setting to defeat the system, but I often forget to put it in that mode.

And as diesels are lean burn, especially at idle, I just can't see that the system saves much fuel unless you drive in a place like Silicon Valley where the stop lights last for what seems like hours.
 
#33 ·
Had the Equinox warmed up putting the steps on in shop, so start stop worked.
As soon as brake is released the engine is running and responded as soon as gas pedal was pressed. No lag at all.
Won't work, for driving, too cold yet, never got above freezing since we bought it.
 
#34 ·
Once you get used to it the stop start is not that big of a deal. Just like it was when ABS, traction control, lane assist et al get introduced it just takes time to adapt,
 
#35 ·
This whole thread boggles my mind. This is a great feature that saves you money, and if you’re driving properly in traffic it should rarely activate - just don’t tailgate leave space and coast as much as you can, trying to never come to a complete stop. Presto, it also just made you a better driver. I drove a diesel opel with this feature and it worked very well.
 
#36 ·
There are times when you have to stop, such as picking up or dropping off a passenger, waiting at a train crossing, traffic light, etc. no matter how good a driver you are. It is these times that the stop-engine technology shines. And since it is seemless to the driver, and saves natural resources, how can one not like it ? Sure, waiting for a left hand turn at a traffic light the first time with this technology may be a little upsetting for the 1st 1/4 second, but you can easily anticipate this and get used to it.
 
#37 ·
My experience with Starter Motors is that they last the life of the vehicle (at least 200,000 miles).

But now with X times more starts, I wonder what this feature will end up doing to that data set. A driver’s door window motor is only going to open/close that window so many times, and a Starter Motor and/or solenoid is only going to start the engine so many times.

Definitely should be a feature under the control of the driver - like cruise control.
 
#38 ·
2X
Let's not forget wear on the flex plate ring gear also. Do they beef it up for that duty? That's not a plug n play part like a starter.
 
  • Like
Reactions: larrywal
#42 ·
I do understand the concern of wear and tear on the starter or battery, but there is a counter point. I don't know what GM is doing, but other manufactures use a little computer trickery to assist the stop/start. One of the main tricks is that the computer times the stop so that the engine is on the downward of a compression stroke. To start again, just injects a little gas in one cylinder and sparks it. That alone is enough to spin the engine over and keep the chain going.

The diesel owners are out of luck though. That has to use the starter. Seems absolutely dumb to force stop/start technology on something as fuel efficient as a diesel.

Again, I don't know if GM does this, just offering an overview of the tech.
 
#43 ·
other manufactures use a little computer trickery to assist the stop/start. One of the main tricks is that the computer times the stop so that the engine is on the downward of a compression stroke. To start again, just injects a little gas in one cylinder and sparks it. That alone is enough to spin the engine over and keep the chain going.
Ohhhh ... that's a good idea. So the use of the starter is greatly reduced. Makes sense.

For those of you with this feature, can you actually *hear* the starter engaging? Just wondering.

Also - wonder why, instead of Start/Stop, they couldn't implement AFM-I (Active Fuel Management for Idling) whereby the engine drops down to 2 (or better yet, even 1) cylinders if stationary for more than X seconds. And then make this timer parameter changeable via the menus so it can be "tuned" by the driver, or even triggered on demand via a button on the steering wheel.
 
#50 ·
Buggsy is on the money with the AFM issues that plague the owners of 2007 and on GM p/u owners, although they seem to have a partial handle on it with the 2014 and later models, hmm, 7 years to find a partial fix, sound familiar? I also frequent the GM p/u forums and am thankful that I have a pre-AFM low mileage 2005 model. But darn, I'm sacrificing 1 or 2 mpg for reliability and longevity.
 
#51 · (Edited)
AFM is used on the new LGZ 3.6L V6 in Colorado/Canyon as well. Of course, thereare only 2 cylinders that are idled. So far, I have not heard of any issues regarding it.

As in the Silverado, it only goes into AFM under low loads mostly around town at slower city driving speeds. It does kick in rarely on the interstate or highway in very flat sections or slight down grades.

I can notice it very slightly at times, but it is very smooth when going back to V6 mode. A green "V4" mode comes on the DIC when it goes into that mode then changes back to "V6".

I will say this, the Colorado with the LGZ 3.6L has been getting 21 to 22 MPG around town in about 60% city (25 to 35 MPH) and 40% semi rural 40 to 55 MPH driving with many stops. This is better than I anticipated and equals or slightly bests the 2015 Equinox LFX 3.6L we also have.

On straight highway trips traveling 65 to 72 MPH I have gotten +26 to +28 MPG over 300 miles at a time fill up to fill up and hand calculated. The wind, hills and traffic make the most difference at highway speeds as usual.
 
#55 · (Edited by Moderator)
Stop/Start System Description and Operation
The Stop/Start System is used to improve fuel efficiency in stop/start driving. The vehicle automatically shuts down the engine in appropriate conditions at a traffic light, for example, resulting in zero tail pipe emissions and saving fuel which otherwise is used idling the engine when stationary. The engine instantly restarts when the driver is ready to move away.
As soon as the driver prepares to move away (by releasing the brake pedal and/or depressing the accelerator pedal), the engine will start; it only takes the system around 0.3 s to start the engine.

To support the increased number of engine starts, the starter motor is upgraded with a high performance electric motor and a stronger pinion engagement mechanism with reduced noise levels.

Along with the upgraded starter motor, advanced battery technology is required to ensure the vehicles battery can handle the frequent charge and discharge cycles common with stop/start operation. There is an intelligent battery sensor connected to the battery which continually monitors the battery charge and healthy state. The engine control module (ECM) uses this information from the intelligent battery sensor to determine if the battery charge and health is sufficient for an Stop/Start condition.

The Stop/Start system can reduce fuel consumption and carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions by up to 5% in mixed driving conditions. In an urban environment and in heavy traffic with frequent stops the savings may increase to as much as 10%.

There are also sophisticated controls in place to help ensure the Stop/Start System does not compromise the needs of either the driver or vehicle. For the engine to shutdown, the vehicle must be below 5 km/h (3 MPH), the selector lever in position D, and brake pedal depressed. To restart, the driver simply releases the brake pedal and the enhanced starter motor engages the engine. When the engine has been shut down by the Stop/Start System, a control indicator will be illuminated in the Driver Information Center (DIC). When the engine is restarted, the control indicator in the DIC extinguishes.

To ensure neither the needs of the driver or vehicle are compromised the engine will not shut down in the following circumstances:
  • Ambient and coolant temperature correlation does not match specified values.
  • Ambient temperature is less than −10°C (14°F)
  • Battery temperature is less than 0°C (32°F) or greater than 55°C (131°F)
  • Driver seat belt is not fastened and the drivers door is not fully closed (not applicable to vehicles in North America)
  • HVAC system demand is high
  • HVAC defrost has been selected
  • Battery charge is low
  • The learn procedure needs to be completed on the Battery Sensor Module
Likewise the engine will automatically restart if:
  • Driver door opened and driver seat belt unbuckled (not applicable to vehicles in North America)
  • Engine hood opened
  • Battery charge is low
  • HVAC demand increases
  • Vehicle speed increases
  • Brake booster vacuum has been reduced
  • Engine coolant temperature is greater than 125°C (257°F)
 
#56 · (Edited by Moderator)
Economy mode turned OFF by driverAutostop time exceeded 2 min. When the Stop/Start System has shut down the engine, and the ambient temperature is below 15°C (59°F), the ECM will activate the Stop/Start auxiliary relay which controls the electric engine coolant pump motor to continually circulate the engine coolant through the engine while the engine is off. This is to ensure the engine and passenger compartment temperature is maintained while off. Once the Stop/Start System has restarted the engine, the ECM will turn off the electric coolant pump motor, thus allowing the engines internal coolant pump to circulate the engine coolant. The Stop/Start System is automatically activated each time the ignition switch is turned on <a id="d929e110">Autostop CriteriaThe ECM will send an Autostop state message to the body control module (BCM) and shut down the engine when all of the following criteria is met. The BCM will transmit the Autostop state message to the instrument cluster which will display the Autostop indicator in the tachometer display.
  • Economy mode turned ON
  • Initial minimum vehicle speed during drive cycle must be 19 km/h (12 MPH) or greater. Subsequent autostop minimum speed may vary from 2-10 km/h (1-6 MPH), depending on vehicle
  • Ambient and engine coolant temperature correlation meets specified values.
  • Ambient and transmission fluid temperature correlation meets specified values.
  • Hood switch status is closed
  • Driver door status is closed
  • Driver seat belt status is buckled
  • Brake booster vacuum is greater than 45 kPa (7 PSI)
  • Transmission gear selector is in the Drive position
  • Vehicle speed is less than 5 km/h (3 MPH)
  • Engine speed is below 1 500 RPM
  • Engine coolant temperature is less than 120°C (248°F)
  • Ambient temperature is greater than −10°C (14°F)
  • No A/C compressor request from HVAC (A/C or Defrost modes)
  • Battery voltage greater than 12 V
  • Battery state of charge greater than 75% (changes with state of health)
 
#57 ·
<a id="d929e388">System Components
Engine Control Module (ECM) The engine control module (ECM) monitors the inputs from the engine coolant temperature (ECT) sensor, vehicle speed sensor (VSS), hood ajar switch, brake booster vacuum sensor, the clutch pedal position sensor, the manual transmission neutral position switch and engine speed to determine Autostart and Autostop conditions. The ECM also controls the auxiliary coolant pump motor.


Transmission Control Module (TCM) The transmission control module monitors the inputs from the transmission neutral safety switch to determine the driver selected gear. This information is transmitted to the ECM via serial data to support the Auto Stop Start algorithm.


Engine Coolant Temperature sensor The ECT sensor is used to determine engine operating temperature.


Intake Air Temperature Sensor The ECM uses this sensor to monitor ambient air temperature. If too cold, the Autostop will not occur.


Inside air temperature sensor The HVAC control module monitors the passenger compartment temperature sensor to determine the temperature inside the passenger compartment. The HVAC control module sends this temperature reading to the ECM on the data communication circuit. The ECM uses this temperature values to determine if a restart is requires based on the temperature inside the passenger compartment.


Vehicle speed sensor The vehicle speed sensor is used to determine vehicle speed. If vehicle speed is detected above a calculated value during an Autostop condition, the ECM will start the engine.


Hood Ajar Switch If the hood switch is in the open position, the vehicle will not Autostop. If the hood is opened during Autostop, the vehicle will automatically restart.


Brake Booster Vacuum Sensor The ECM monitors vacuum in order to ensure proper power assist for the brake pedal. If the ECM determines vacuum is too low, it will restart the engine.


Brake Pedal Position Sensor & Accelerator Pedal Position Sensor The ECM monitors both the brake pedal position sensor and the accelerator pedal position sensor to determine the level of activation for each. While the accelerator pedal is in it’s at rest position with no pressure applied by the operator, a partially depressed Brake pedal will cause the ECM to prepare the engine for an Autostop event. When the vehicle is in an auto stop event and the status of the brake pedal position sensor changes from meeting the autostop criteria to not meeting this criteria the engine will be restarted provided all of the other conditions to allow an autostart are met. If the Accelerator pedal is moved from its at rest position the vehicle will also enter an auto start event if all other conditions to support an autostart event, except for the brake pedal position, are met.


Transmission Gear Shift Position Switch The transmission gear shift position switch is used to determine if the transmission is in the proper state to allow an auto stop/start event. The ECM will not allow Autostop until the brake is engaged, the transmission is in the forward gear position and then the vehicle slows to below the minimum speed required to allow and autostop while meeting all of the other minimum criteria to support an autostop event.


Coolant Pump Motor The ECM will turn on the auxiliary coolant pump motor during Autostop to maintain engine operating temperature and also maintain HVAC temperature. Once the engine is running, the ECM will turn off the coolant pump motor.


Body Control Module (BCM) The body control module (BCM) is the master of the low speed communication bus and transfers the appropriate messages to the instrument cluster and the HVAC.


Battery Sensor Module The ECM monitors the intelligent battery sensor for battery state of current, state of health, and battery charge via the data communication bus. If the battery is determined to be in poor state of health or having a low charge, the ECM will not allow Autostop to occur.


Power Supply Transformer The DC to DC converter monitors battery voltage and will maintain operating voltage to the radio, instrument cluster and instrument panel displays. The DC to DC converter will provide a boosted voltage to sensitive loads during Autostart to ensure proper operation of the driver informational displays.


Driver Door Switch The BCM monitors the driver door switch at all times. The BCM will not allow Autostop if the door is ajar and will Autostart if the driver door is opened and the seat belt unbuckled during Autostop.


Driver Seat Belt Switch The BCM monitors the driver seat belt switch at all times. The BCM will Autostart if the seat belt is unbuckled and the driver door opened during Autostop.


Instrument Cluster In order to differentiate between a normal engine shut down (engine speed 0 RPM) and when the engine has been shut down by the Stop/Start System, the tachometer needle will rest at the Autostop indicator icon (500 RPM point) indicating the engine has been shut down by the Stop/Start System. Once the engine is restarted, the tachometer will function normally.
 
#59 ·
Thanks BigB12359 . . As always.. the most accurate info!

And . . thinking.. . Maybe a place to easily rig up an "Stop/Start" disable switch?

"- Hood Ajar Switch If the hood switch is in the open position, the vehicle will not Autostop. If the hood is opened during Autostop, the vehicle will automatically restart. "

Run some wires to the switch and simulate an "Open Hood" Condition? Any other negative effects of that? I can think of maybe one or two.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bigb12359
#62 ·
I'm pretty sure it will display "Hood Open" on the DIC. It might ding at you when you start to drive, and it will definitely disable the remote start.

Someone can verify this by just popping the hood release and going like 5 MPH. Personally, I'd rather get in the habit of going to manual mode than I would give up remote start or want to clear the DIC at every start.

Unplugging the seat belt sensor would do the same thing (chime at your twice), but not defeat the remote start option.
 
#63 · (Edited)
Wire in a relay to IGN or KeyOn power, etc. It would still allow remote start and only open the hood switch circuit after you enter and start the car. Then all you would see is the light on the dash.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top